Streaming server services for mimoLive

Anyone know of an affordable streaming server service for mimoLive? My project is to host a small film festival. However, YouTube/Google blocked a single test of G/PG13 content (6 short films.) They won’t say why, but I assume it may be because they believe the content is copyrighted (we secured rights for screening via FilmFreeway, so content copyright isn’t an issue.)
I reviewed/contacted the top 10 providers, but there is no way I can afford the monthly costs.

YT/Google suggests these steps:

Live stream licensed third-party content

If you’ve licensed third-party content to use in your stream, ask the owner of the content to add your channel to their allowlist through Content ID.

If your channel isn’t added to their allowlist, your live stream can be interrupted even if you’ve licensed the third-party content. Your live stream can also be interrupted even if you’ve restricted it to territories where you own all the necessary rights to the content if your channel isn’t added to the content owner’s allowlist.

Thanks for the suggestion. I have over 900 films submitted to the festival and appx 300 are generally screened. Trying to find and fix copyright issues is just too much for one person, especially with the bulk of the films from international sources with limited communication. The FilmFreeway process is designed to deal with this using agreements for screening of copyrighted content. Unfortunately, YouTube/Google have their own system and they don’t agree. Facebook/Meta seems to have a similar system. I attempted to appeal again, but they replied ‘stop contacting us.’

Hi @junk1 Thanks for reaching out in the forums!

If you expect relatively few viewers, you could set up your own streaming server using a standard hosting provider. What’s the budget you can afford for the event?

@junk1 Could you please list the providers you’ve discarded and the reason why (for example because they asked $5000)? This way we can propose solutions beyond what you’ve already tried.

Here are the streaming server services I contacted/evaluated/tested. I didn’t expect the immediate and heavy-handed issues with YouTube, hence my free festival plan didn’t anticipate paying for streaming. Since the goal is a simple app that can be run from a smart television, some services may not work well/easily. The nature of the FilmFreeway submissions is such that I generally can’t provide viewing on an unrestricted, ad-hoc basis. Current streaming Festival solutions are paid, on-demand to limit accessibility. In addition, the local PUFF audience seems to prefer an ‘event’ with live film commentary and discussion, hence mimoLive. They didn’t take advantage of pandemic solutions that were non-streaming on-demand.
I investigated rolling my own server with a hosting provider, but wasn’t finding a solution that seemed to fit. If you have recommendations that is great. I have to pay for this completely myself, so it has to be <$50/mo US, probably asking too much.
YouTube: Channel was terminated, for unexplained reasons, after 2 short test runs
Facebook: Has community guidelines/terminations similar to YT and interface presented issues on smart TV
RTMP Server: To get > 1.7M bit rate was $700+/mo
Vimeo/Livestream: Never responded to request for guidance on supporting film festival format (copyright scanning). Premium is $75/mo annual payment. My experience with Vimeo hosted streaming (via FilmFreeway) is a lot of buffering delays. Didn’t want to experimentally invest $900 to get slapped down.
DailyMotion: Responded they no longer support Live streaming without verification badge, monetization and are screened by them individually for popularity, reputation and content
DaCast: Not affordable
centerserv: Not affordable (minimum $180/mo)
JWPlayer: Live streaming only with Enterprise
Kaltura: Pricing not readily available
SproutVideo: Pricing plan needs monetization to support addtl costs
Muvi: Expensive
StreamShark: Expensive
Your advice is appreciated since I’m very new at this.

Hi Jim, Thanks for the comprehensive list. I see you covered most.

Do I understand correctly, that you want to put up a pay wall so that people have to pay for access to the stream? In this case, the streaming could pay for itself. You could try Zoom Webinars for that or

Unfortunately, I’m unable to institute a pay wall as most other online festivals are doing now. The FilmFreeway option that PUFF uses has to ensure that film makers are not charged for submissions and the audience is not charged admission. It must be totally free for all. There is no money involved and I pay for everything with my retirement income. As an individual, the costs for setting up a business model for the Pop Up Film Festival are not worth the effort. You can learn more about the festival here: . Basically, it was started as a local, community supporting event. Then the Covid 19 pandemic hit and nothing is the same. All of the venues we used either went out of business or moved into smaller facilities. My goal, with this latest iteration, is to stream to small groups via TVs at a number of smaller venues and simultaneously stream to individuals who can’t attend due to covid concerns. Unfortunately, this area is one of those in the USA where vaccination is not popular, and the rate is just over 50%. Large gatherings in theaters/stages creates a substantive risk. My original thinking was that mimoLive + YouTube is an ideal solution, but YouTube/Google thinks otherwise. Their AI driven copyright infringement process apparently can’t deal with small film festivals like PUFF. And, they are unwilling to communicate with me directly. Regards, Jim

And, I would hate to give up that exquisite piece of software called mimoLive!

So, how many streams do you think you’ll need?

My initial thinking was 2 per week. 1 to 1 1/2 hrs each (6 films+commentary). Individual films are limited to < 20 mins and range in size from 400M to 2.2G. Assuming ~5mbps it appears that is 2.2 to 3.5gb per session (if my math is right) or +350G/yr. This would fit under the Vimeo Pro plan.
However, I burned up a couple of hours last night reviewing various stream server restrictions/guidelines and am now more or less resigned to the conclusion that the free, streaming film festival format is not workable given copyright and DRM issues and monitoring systems. After re-researching the FilmFreeway guidelines it appears that copyright/media rights are mostly self-declared by the original film makers with no verifiable/enforceable proof required. Physical festivals are largely slipping through this loophole as the likelihood of a troll showing up in a theater is rare (although it did happen at a Montana festival 2 years ago.) Pay wall services similarly seem to be unaffected/undetected.
The covid 19 pandemic has upended many things, PUFF one of them. I think it’s time to re-think and come up with a new community support idea that has less risk, for both the audience and me. MimoLive is still at the center, I’ll just need to rethink content. Thanks for the feedback, now we just have to fix the crashing issue, which Achim is evaluating.

I’m sad to hear that. Let’s hope there is a better opportunity moving forward.

What about a zoom-party? Virtual camera + virtual sound? Seems to be unconventional, but maybe zoom loves the idea… I’m sure that they can handle more than 100 participants. Also with “podium discussions” :slight_smile:

Never had troubles with copyright there. Even if I could have… :wink:

Thanks for the suggestion. I explored/tried that idea. What really made me think the festival would work simultaneously for both TV and online streaming was after I downloaded mimoLive, configured a couple of test broadcasts and did sent them live with TVs and online testers. Pre-pandemic, when we had the live and in-person film festivals, I learned very quickly that unexpected things can happen, both with the film presentation and the audience. The very easy, and immense, control that mimoLive offers is just what is needed for a 1 person process. In the tests I was quickly able to re-configure the broadcast on the fly, and easily include/exclude audience participation, using the control board. My previous experiences with Zoom/Teams and other peer systems is that both technical and people issues were more difficult to solve and execute successfully. I have my thinking cap on, thanks to the good feedback from the forum, and will see if I can come up with an entirely new idea.

Yes, we’re facing crazy ages (in all ages. :hugs:). I can feel your energy, I’m sure you’ll find a way to keep it alive. Just for info: I was a typical German teacher for German as foreign and secundary language. Now, I’m a YouTube creator! :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: - I never expected this! :joy::joy::joy: